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DayLahs

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Gather Round Matt(IGN) Vs. David(NintendoNow)

courtesy of nintendo now

The following is a roundtable discussion between Matt Casamassina and David Gornoski. Matt Casamassina is the editor of IGNCube.com, a division of IGN Entertainment, Inc. David Gornoski is the Editor-in-Chief of NintendoNow.com, a division of E-mpire Ltd. Co. It should be noted that the debate took place using an Instant Messaging service in a casual format but has been edited for clarity. Also, neither individual was fully aware of the other's identity until after the debate.

David: Why add to the culture of negativity that is found in the majority of the mainstream gaming press? Why not take a different stand and offer something different than rival publications? Promoting the Hollywoodization of the industry is the "in" thing to do right now in the gaming media. Why not set yourself apart and take a stand against it?

Matt: Why would I want to do that? I like games with robust production values. Why would I want to take a step backward just to be different?

David: Maybe you don't understand what I mean by "Hollywoodization." I like games with high production values as well. That's not the point. Hollywoodization is the process of turning the gaming industry into a superficial one. One where the main priorities are things like graphics, pretty pictures, gore, sex, excessive violence, trendy themes, etc. We don't need all of that in this industry. I'm a firm believer in the back to basics approach to gaming. Yes, graphical upgrades are a plus. But they should be seen as icing on the cake, not the main course. You talk about HD as if it's the engine of a car when in fact it's more like leather seats.

Matt: That's a generalization. Higher production values and good gameplay mechanics are not mutually exclusive. There's no reason both can't happily coexist. Nintendo's biggest game this generation exemplifies that strategy perfectly. Zelda is a mixture of epic production values and fantastic gameplay.

David: Well, like I said, production value is a great addition to games. But I think you're mixing good looking graphics with a crisp resolution on your TV. A crisp resolution is not the equivalent of a car's engine.

Matt: HD is important to me, but it's not integral. I'll buy Revolution regardless. However, to dismiss HD simply because it costs more money is disappointing. Why anybody would defend Nintendo on this front is beyond me. The company is shortchanging gamers because it doesn't want to spend extra cash and resources to make games HD compatible. That's it.

David: Well if you read the article it doesn't necessarily defend Nintendo's decision, does it?

Matt: If you read our article, we don't exactly dismiss Nintendo, either. There's a difference between a news piece on our site and a rant in my mailbag section. The mailbag is a forum for editorializing. It gives me a chance to share my opinions to readers.

David: I never said I'm not concerned that the HD decision will hurt sales. But what I addressed was your over-emphasis on the feature, and the name calling and ranting that ensued. As for my question I posed, why do we never hear complaints from the media about Sony and Microsoft shortchanging fans by sacrificing innovation and new gaming experiences for the latest expensive technology extension? It just seems one-sided to me.

Matt: Because Microsoft and Sony haven't done that.

David: They're innovating?

Matt: Yes. Xbox Live was perhaps the biggest innovation this generation. Nintendo copied Sony's EyeToy, meanwhile. To say that neither challenger is innovating is absurd. Fact is all of the companies innovate. However, with Nintendo, it oftentimes seems to come at the expense of technology, at least where next-generation consoles are concerned.

David: Well, online consoles really aren't anything new. We've seen that since the NES days. I was referring to the Xbox 360 and PS3, where's the innovation? Where are the new gaming experiences? The new genres? You're getting the definition of the Hollywood ideal in gaming – glitzy realism, hip games, over-emphasis on graphical horsepower, etc.

Matt: Hey, at least Sony and Microsoft launched more than one new IP this generation. Has Nintendo released a single GCN title -- other than Pikmin -- that wasn't based on an existing franchise or character? Internally developed, I mean.

David: I don't think re-used franchises should be the basis for defining innovative games. It's how they play. Take Donkey Kong: Jungle Beat for example.

Matt: A great game, yep. It's these types of titles that make Nintendo a powerhouse. But to say that Sony and Microsoft brought nothing to the table is wrong.

David: With PS3 and Xbox 360 we're not getting any new game experiences or new ways to interact. I said where's the innovation in the next consoles.

Matt: That's impossible to know. Xbox 360 and PS3 have barely shown. We only know about a handful of games.

David: Xbox Live isn't that innovative, by the way. EyeToy, yes. And as we're going to see with Warp Pipe Technology's new online platform, Xbox Live is using antiquated technology and features. It's borrowing the PC online infrastructure rather than creating a new one for consoles.

Matt: I look at titles like Alan Wake for 360 and I'm actually kind of intrigued. Looks to deliver a very unique storyline complemented by amazing ambience and mood. If the next-generation is all about enveloping gamers in believable stories, I think that's innovating.

David: I'm a believer in the back to basics approach to gaming. We don't need to see our industry turn into the next superficial Hollywood - an industry where innovation and family values are shunned. We don't need this overemphasis on resolutions, gore, sexual themes, and "hip", trendy games. We need to go back to the basics, the way gaming used to be. We need to have an industry that's all about exploring new ways to play games and keeping the industry from losing its proverbial innocence.

Matt: Well, I'll just say that higher production values do not necessitate an overemphasis on gore, sexual themes and hip or trendy software. I just have to disagree. And if you think gaming is going back to the basics, you're in for a rude awakening. The biggest-sellers this generation have been anything but basic. In other words, you may want this, but the majority of players obviously do not.

David: No, I never said it was going back to the basics. I'm saying it needs to. Graphics will always improve. And that's an essential part of growth in this industry, but it's getting too much emphasis. Then you look at what's on these consoles today. Most of it is garbage - graphic shooters, immature sexual, perverted games, shallow "gangsta" themes, etc. Quality and wholesome family games have been on a steady decline with each generation. A guy can't even play a game with his kids anymore.

Matt: Sure you can. You just have to pick the right games. But I agree completely about some of the themes in games today. I refuse to play many of the titles out there, Grand Theft Auto included. Shock value, violence and gore do not appeal to me.

David: There is most definitely a large audience out there that agrees exactly with what I'm saying. I call them the "reactionaries" of the games industry. After all, we're seeing this innovative, quirky handheld - the DS - besting the glitzy, beautiful PSP. So that's testament that there is a large reactionary segment in this industry.

Matt: I expect there will always be an audience for family friendly games. An industry without a new Mario would be a sad place indeed. On the other hand, a console should not be designed from the ground up to be unable to play more sophisticated software. This has been my beef with Revolution thus far and I stand by it. There's nothing that says Microsoft and Sony can't create simpler, gameplay-led software on their next-gen systems. However, Nintendo has already taken itself out of the market for HD gaming.

David: To correct something said earlier, I didn't say high production values put emphasis on gore, sex, and trendy games. I said they go hand in hand as the industry tries to emulate Hollywood's model.

Matt: The industry is growing. I liken it to the Hollywood of the late 80s and early 90s, where gory movies full of bullets and nudity reigned supreme. The GTAs and gangster rip-offs are saturating the place right now, but that won't always be the case. Better technology merely enables developers to more accurately realize their visions. I'm all for it and sooner or later we're going to get some truly thoughtful, compelling titles because of it.

David: Well HD has nothing to do with thoughtful, compelling software. Graphics can help those areas though. One thing about HD. Didn't you say you hate poor performance when it comes to frame rates? Yet, I may be mistaken here though, isn't it true that by making these games built for HDTVs we will see that it will be harder for games to maintain satisfactory frame rates on a regular TV set?

Matt: Yep. Running games in high-resolution could present frame-rate problems on the next-generation consoles. Then again, maybe not. It's too early to tell how it's going to swing because nobody has final hardware yet. It's definitely a very dangerous downside to developing software in high-resolution.

David: We have no clue how the Revolution's graphics will look. We're only assuming they will look worse because the execs have said they are not looking to beef up horsepower. But as we've seen with Japanese imports, more horsepower does not necessarily mean better performance. So which would you prefer: solid frame rates w/ no HD or poor frame rates w/ HD?

Matt: Tough one. I'm a stickler for fluidity, so I'd go with frame-rates. Still, we don't know for sure if HD games will really run bad on these new consoles. It's a potential problem articulated by one developer.

David: That's true, and we also don't know quite for sure if Revolution will not have HD support. So a lot of things are still up in the air. Though I've been wondering about that patent Nintendo filed a while back which was describing a new way to view games with a fixed view point - some have said a reference to some sort of 3D/holographic technology. If this is something they use with the Revolution, will HD even matter at all?

Matt: Don't know. Could render it useless at that point.

David: So as we see, there are so many wildcards with these console developments. Will HD hurt frame-rates? How pretty will Revolution's graphics look? Will they turn around and include HD support for the Revolution? And if this fixed viewpoint patent is used, will HD even matter?

Matt: Well, Nintendo has recently suggested that the so-called "revolution" will pertain to the system's new controller, so I'm inclined to believe that any fixed viewpoint patents are probably not related. Which brings us back to point zero. It's disappointing, of course, that Revolution doesn't (yet) support HD. But the bigger let down, to me, is that this choice seems to suggest that Nintendo is again abandoning one demographic to appease another. The Revolution may appeal to an all-new audience of non-gamers, but there is also an existing audience of hardcore players who would very much like the cutting-edge in technology and the best in games. That they should be forced to choose is, I think, a mistake. Nintendo is no longer the only choice on the market. Gamers can look elsewhere for their fix. It's time Nintendo realized that.

David Gornoski's Conclusion:

I think it's quite clear that Nintendo has created a variety of aspects for the Revolution that all culminate into a "revolution" in gaming. I think the controller is definitely one of the biggest pieces to the Revolution's unique puzzle, but so is the non-gamer approach, virtual console features, and perhaps a new way to view the games we play. Virtual Reality peripherals, fixed viewpoint projections, customizable games--really at this point any of those are possible.

Not including HD support in the Revolution may very well be a costly mistake. But again, at this point we're basing this on speculation. Even the HDTV purchase predictions for the next three years are merely industry guesses. And like we've said, HD support for the Revolution is not totally ruled out. Matt himself has admitted that if HD support would hinder frame-rates, he would prefer no HD support. So what it all boils down to at the moment is we just do not know for sure what is in store. Let us not cast a condemning eye on Nintendo's decision just yet. There are too many unknowns at this stage of the game.

As for the Hollywoodization of the gaming industry, it is really up to the gamers. Ultimately they will decide what the industry will look like by the purchases they make. Do you want an emphasis on eye candy, violence, sex, or hip themes? Or do you care more about challenging game play, innovation, and family friendly themes? The fate of the industry rests in the consumer's hands.

Pojo

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I laughed after reading this. This is something you see on Hannity and Colmes...but with video games instead of politics.

And besides, N-PHILES HAD THIS ARGUMENT, LIKE, A WEEK AGO LOL. We just were not quite as articulate as Matt and David.
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Aipotu

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Somehow, reading about two people bickering about Nintendo is rather boring. They should have shot a video. and included a food fight. And maybe an explosion. One of them dies. but which one? sequel!

Spawn

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I thought that was quite a good chat. Eventually they come to the conclusion that they still know nothing good enough to make all these judgements, which is kind of laughable.

The discussion was at least a lot better than the HD arguments I've seen on these board.

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Pojo
I laughed after reading this. This is something you see on Hannity and Colmes...but with video games instead of politics.

Except the Colmes isn't being the Hannity's right hand bitch!
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Ninjazn

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I've heard that this was fake. I won't continue, but I honestly feel it may be fake.

Otherwise, it just seems like two people arguing over something that doesn't truly matter.
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Matt sucks!

kinopio

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And the other guy sucks even more!
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His name is David!

Why don't you do the research next time before you say something SO stupid.

kinopio

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Joester
Matt sucks!

I'd just love to see all the research you've done to justify the above statement, but I've got better things to do. I think I'll go wash my hair.
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Go here> www.matsucksup.org

It has everything you and the Nintendo hating populous needs to know.

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That David guy sounds like a flaming fanboy.
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octorok and roll
That David guy sounds like a flaming fanboy.

I could probably have tolerated that had his site not been so awful!
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Both of those guys are hopeless idiots.
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octorok and roll

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At least Matt is intelligent though... if not a little bit full of himself, but I probably would be too if I was the EIC of IGN Cube.
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octorok and roll
That David guy sounds like a flaming fanboy.

He is a flaming fanboy. In fact, his entire site is composed of flaming fanboys or complete dumbasses. They've written 3 different articles (editorial / features) that simply bash other publications. They have an IGN one, and EGM one, and a... I can't remember, it's some Nintendo fansite that they don't like (EDIT - GCA). For about a month I read their site, and I couldn't believe how stupid some of their articles were.

For example, a psp bashing article they wrote before its japanese launch:
http://www.nintendonow.com/index.php?categoryid=5&m_articles_articleid=1796

IGN bash article:
http://www.nintendonow.com/index.php?categoryid=5&m_articles_articleid=1894

EGM bash article:
http://www.nintendonow.com/index.php?categoryid=5&m_articles_articleid=2087

Oh and for some reason, their game of the year feature included games from other consoles, even though they're a Nintendo fansite. WTF
http://www.nintendonow.com/index.php?categoryid=6&m_articles_articleid=1935

Personally, I'm surprised that Matt even agreed to this, seeing as they spend have their time bashing him, and overall it's not a very good site.

Maxwell

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This David guy is a ****in' frootloop. Evidence: Demasked (an unfunded, unknown, unsupported pipe dream of a few egotistic amateur) is going to unseat X-Box Live. Buwha?! That's just the beginning, though.

I don't care about HDTV, personally, but this guy is nowhere near Matt's league.

Or kinopio's, for that matter.
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kinopio

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Wait till you see my site: nintendoperhapslater.com

And I didn't even know Nintendonow or that guy had something to do with Demasked, even more reason to make fun of them lol

.
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Dawson
Both of those guys are hopeless idiots.

Yes
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I seriously think that David guy is Vert1
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Nintendo Now itself is just a peice of trash. Which makes me seriously wonder how they got Matt to stoop down to their level.
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objection

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you know that since you guys are ragging in this david dude that they're going to write an article about how much n-philes sucks now right

these dudes were trying to buy n-philes a few months ago fyi

Rocksteady

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How much?

Rogue

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XD

I remember that. Had no idea it was NintendoNow though.

Phlogistic

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I think they were trying to buy a site whose forum I mod at, too. Actually, they offered an excellent deal, but I guess it fell through.
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Rocksteady
How much?

Let's just say: And you thought the NHL exclusivity was a bargain!

:zing:
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Hero

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NightsB
you know that since you guys are ragging in this david dude that they're going to write an article about how much n-philes sucks now right

these dudes were trying to buy n-philes a few months ago fyi

Thank you for not selling. Why exactly would they want to buy this site though? (not that is sucks or anything), but they're already a Nintendo site...

And I was under the impression that they had already ragged on N-Philes. I recall someone mentionning a thread in their forums like that or something.

objection

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they thought i was destroying it and they wanted to take it from us and "save it" with generic content you can find on like, every mediocre nintendo site ever

Ninjazn

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"Save it"? Lmao. lol

Nintendo Now "saving" anything is just irony. Their own site is pure crap, how could they manage another?
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Xiu Xiu

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Our forum rules. And this was so stupid.

Pithy

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wow good thing you didnt sell it to NN

and this got boring because its the same thing that we talk about only with bigger words and less talk about stupid sh!t

Ninjazn

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Haha look at IGN Cube's latest mailbag. This is Matt's response to his discussion with David of NNow.

The "debate" with that David character was a bit of a surprise. Apparently my IM user name got out the other day and I kept receiving random messages from people. He was one of them. He sort of just started in about high-definition and Revolution, an issue I've been outspoken on, and then accused me of this and that, and so on and so forth. I merely defended my views. I had no idea who the guy was, mind you, and also had no idea that he was planning to use our little conversation as a premiere attraction on his site.

He contacted me the next day and explained who he was and then asked if it would be okay if he posted our conversation on his site as an official debate. My initial response was no -- in truth, I had already forgotten what I said, as my brain is clinically non-functioning. He sent a draft of our conversation, I read it over, and decided to let him post it, with the stipulation that he make his readers aware that I had no idea who I was talking to until well after the debate ended. I expect that if I did, some of my responses would have been more organized.

For whatever unexplainable reason, he instead chose to write in his article that neither participant had any idea who the other was, which makes zero sense. Is he implying that he merely contacted a random person to debate Revolution and high-definition, and that person just by coincidence turned out to be me? Wow. That is lucky!

Matt: 1 David: -5

David = Owned.
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Needle Mouse

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Matt still sucks.

Maxwell

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Heh heh heh. Like that wasn't obvious from the start Tongue

What a load of maroons.
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Ninjazn
Haha look at IGN Cube's latest mailbag. This is Matt's response to his discussion with David of NNow.

Matt: 1 David: -5

David = Owned.

Yeah, I thought that was really funny.

Keazu

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N-philes vs. NNow Battle, begin.
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Link Floyd

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It was pretty clear from the onset that Matt was getting ambushed. And still he managed to talk circles around this NintendoNow clown.
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I haven't been here very long, but it's pretty painfully obvious you guys have a real sense of desire for both IGN and Matt. Personally, I don't mind the website, but they're not always the angels you make them out to be. That 'IGNorance is bliss' article was actually quite impressive, as it showed a small fansite taking on the biggest games related website the world has ever seen, and doing a good job. Sure enough some of the points were a little unrelated. But the fact that they put emphasis on Matt acting like a bitch after THEIR OWN MEMBERS criticised their crappy coverage of the DS launch in Japan actually made me laugh out loud.

The PSP article you pointed out, was written by 'The Observer'. A person, who I would quite literally regard as one of the finest games journalists online. He made some very valid points, and backed up his claims. Whats wrong with that? Perhaps you should read the comments like when one pseudo-intellectual tries to take him on, and gets a verbal beat-down. Or better still, perhaps you should leave "a criticism" Meloche. So I can laugh when he dismantles your every point.

Considering that fact that N-Philes is a fansite, don't you think you're being a little harsh? Sure, David is quite obviously a fanboy, but he put up a decent enough argument against Matt.

Darkdolphin

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Bionic Commando
I haven't been here very long, but it's pretty painfully obvious you guys have a real sense of desire for both IGN and Matt. Personally, I don't mind the website, but they're not always the angels you make them out to be...

Sure, David is quite obviously a fanboy, but he put up a decent enough argument against Matt.

I can tell that you haven't been here very long, because I'd say the majority of people here generally claim to dislike IGN.

And whether or not he put up a decent arguement is irrelevant to the fact that he randomly IMed Matt and started debating him, without Matt knowing he was going to be featured on a fansite until the end. That type of "debate" alone is laughable on NintendoNow's part. I'm glad Matt let them put it up and then clarified it, because I found it really funny that they would be that desperate for an exclusive.

Bionic Commando

Tom Cruisin'

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Yeah, admittedly I haven't. But from what i've seen, IGN are infallible. Maybe i've been reading the wrong threads, but it seems to me like they can do no wrong. I strenuously disagree.

The random IM thing was pretty pointless, I agree. But somehow I doubt in any other circumstances Matt would have any time for them. It was obviously an act of desperation, but it worked. As i'm sure the website got quite a few hits through word of mouth and so on. Maybe it should have been clarified at the beginning, but the reason it wasn't was probably because David wanted to win the argument. I get the feeling Matt would have taken it a little more seriously had he known exactly what was going on, but really the "debate" boils down to a clash of ideologies.

I do enjoy reading NintendoNow articles. Some are well-thought out, and compelling for a small-ish Nintendo fansite. The aforementioned type of fansite is a rare breed these days, so we should at least give some form of support.

Hero

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Bionic Commando
I haven't been here very long, but it's pretty painfully obvious you guys have a real sense of desire for both IGN and Matt. Personally, I don't mind the website, but they're not always the angels you make them out to be. That 'IGNorance is bliss' article was actually quite impressive, as it showed a small fansite taking on the biggest games related website the world has ever seen, and doing a good job. Sure enough some of the points were a little unrelated.

Like DarkDolphin said, most people here don't love Matt. It's really a case of the lesser of two evils here. I dislike Matt, but I dislike NintendoNow even more. Do you see how that works?

Bionic Commando

But the fact that they put emphasis on Matt acting like a bitch after THEIR OWN MEMBERS criticised their crappy coverage of the DS launch in Japan actually made me laugh out loud.

Who's own members? I'm sorry but this part makes no sense.

Bionic Commando

The PSP article you pointed out, was written by 'The Observer'. A person, who I would quite literally regard as one of the finest games journalists online.

Really? He's one of the finest journalists online huh? So where is he now? Why has he only written two articles for NintendoNow, and both last year. Are you sure he even works for them anymore?

Bionic Commando

He made some very valid points, and backed up his claims. Whats wrong with that?

Besides the fact that it's merely a fanboy attacking the competition? Or that he wrote the article before the system even launched (that's including Japan)? Or that it's all merely conjecture because the system again, wasn't available to be played by the general public at that time? Or that an article about the PSP doesn't belong on a strictly Nintendo site?
I could continue. Really though, I don't think I have to. I read some of the comments after that article, and really, Observer had no reason to write that article. One of his defenses was that "people deserve to know that the psp is a shoddy product." Really? Now why would people need to know that on a Nintendo-only site? Or was it simply written so that Nintendo fanboys could tape it to their wall and read it before going to sleep every night?

Bionic Commando

Perhaps you should read the comments like when one pseudo-intellectual tries to take him on, and gets a verbal beat-down. Or better still, perhaps you should leave "a criticism" Meloche. So I can laugh when he dismantles your every point.

Why bother? Commenting on dead articles who's author probably doesn't even work for the site anymore is a waste of time. But really, you think he could dismantle my every point? Frankly, I couldn't care less. He can keep the satisfaction that he helps little Nintendo fanboys sleep at night. And really, I don't consider the comments section of his features to be a very good place to discuss the validity of his articles. Espescially seeing as he has the power to edit and delete any post made in that area.
As a journalist though, he should know better. Posting **** like that on a site, fansite or no, is completely unprofessional. The fact is though, he's not alone. NintendoNow has done several articles like that, and I'm sure they've got plenty more in the works. Really, I wouldnt' want to associate myself with a site like that. All I'm doing is voicing my disgust over what they're doing.

Bionic Commando

Considering that fact that N-Philes is a fansite, don't you think you're being a little harsh? Sure, David is quite obviously a fanboy, but he put up a decent enough argument against Matt.

Who cares? Really, who cares? Fact is, that was an incredibly stupid thing to do. I don't care if he put up a good argument or not. Sneaky **** like that is not something an organisation like that should pride itself on. It's really quite disgusting.

Oh, and Bionic Commando, just out of curiosity, do you happen to have any affiliation to NintendoNow? Just curious.

Ninjazn

.ninja

Posts: 4,753

Join Date: Jun 2003

Location: Richmond, VA

I bet you Bionic Commando goes to NNow. lol

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Robjomak

still going strong

Posts: 8,019

Join Date: Jan 2005

Location: Philadelphia

Meloche, I may not be ready to give them even that much credit: the fact that they did hunt Matt down so unprofessionally like that only adds to his authority (that they'd have to do something like that) so in reality they aren't beating him for all to see to somehow discredit the comments he's made they certainly construe as anti-Nintendo, to help fanboys sleep at night as you put it, they are just alluding to him to get more hits. That's the only tangible result of this. It's not even about defending Nintendo, it's about their own egos.

If I were in Matt's position I would have denied the entire thing and let them scream into the void about it from their tiny corner of the net. Or just did it "a certain site" instead of pointing more people to their site.

Bionic Commando

Tom Cruisin'

Posts: 4,346

Join Date: Apr 2005

Location: Irlanda Del Norte

Meloche
Like DarkDolphin said, most people here don't love Matt. It's really a case of the lesser of two evils here. I dislike Matt, but I dislike NintendoNow even more. Do you see how that works?

Who's own members? I'm sorry but this part makes no sense.

Really? He's one of the finest journalists online huh? So where is he now? Why has he only written two articles for NintendoNow, and both last year. Are you sure he even works for them anymore?

Besides the fact that it's merely a fanboy attacking the competition? Or that he wrote the article before the system even launched (that's including Japan)? Or that it's all merely conjecture because the system again, wasn't available to be played by the general public at that time? Or that an article about the PSP doesn't belong on a strictly Nintendo site?
I could continue. Really though, I don't think I have to. I read some of the comments after that article, and really, Observer had no reason to write that article. One of his defenses was that "people deserve to know that the psp is a shoddy product." Really? Now why would people need to know that on a Nintendo-only site? Or was it simply written so that Nintendo fanboys could tape it to their wall and read it before going to sleep every night?

Why bother? Commenting on dead articles who's author probably doesn't even work for the site anymore is a waste of time. But really, you think he could dismantle my every point? Frankly, I couldn't care less. He can keep the satisfaction that he helps little Nintendo fanboys sleep at night. And really, I don't consider the comments section of his features to be a very good place to discuss the validity of his articles. Espescially seeing as he has the power to edit and delete any post made in that area.
As a journalist though, he should know better. Posting **** like that on a site, fansite or no, is completely unprofessional. The fact is though, he's not alone. NintendoNow has done several articles like that, and I'm sure they've got plenty more in the works. Really, I wouldnt' want to associate myself with a site like that. All I'm doing is voicing my disgust over what they're doing.

Who cares? Really, who cares? Fact is, that was an incredibly stupid thing to do. I don't care if he put up a good argument or not. Sneaky **** like that is not something an organisation like that should pride itself on. It's really quite disgusting.

Oh, and Bionic Commando, just out of curiosity, do you happen to have any affiliation to NintendoNow? Just curious.

Well, i'm just going on what I have seen from scanning through nunerous threads on here for the past few months. I generally get the impression that a lot of people (not necessarily you) seem to deem IGN as some sort of infallible "reliable" website which has your best interests in mind. Sure thing...

Sorry, I had a mix-up on that front. It wasn't Matt, it was Craig Harris. After IGN recieved many a complaint from THEIR MEMBERS (ie. those who pay subscription fees) which indicated that they had deliberately downplayed the DS launch in Japan, by saying such drivel as: "We'd describe the Japanese DS launch as boring. Then again, we presume we'll look back upon it fondly next week when we're fighting off crowds to get one of the few available PSP units". They acted like little sissies in response, to the very people who pay their wages by stating: "Man, I thought the defensive GameCube fanbase had a bunch of nutcases. But apparently this blind Nintendo faith has trickled into the Nintendo DS population. You guys are absolutely vicious. Where were you during the Game Boy Advance launch?" - Now that's a very smart thing to say. Maybe if they hadn't cocked up in the first place (sending one man to investigate a major launch is a bad idea) they wouldn't have been criticised. Arrogance is all it is. That's the part I found the funniest. Didn't you read the article you slandered?

You know, some sites don't get paid for their work. Some websites do it for the passion (and the attention). I'm sure he has to keep up a full time job which leaves him restricted from writing articles for a Nintendo fansite. Either way, those two articles are a hell of a lot better than anything i've read from IGN, Gamespy or even Gamespot.

You believe fansites for a particular company aren't allowed to make digs at other companies? You haven't visited many then. The fact is, he backed up everything he said in that article and based his information judging on analysts predictions, past records and technical specifications. Turned out he was right on most fronts.

Again, if you had a problem with what he had written. You should have posted it on the 'comments' section. It'd have given me a good laugh. The fact is, you're criticising him on a seperate Nintendo fansite he probably isn't even a part of. Grow some balls, and go email him or something. Hell, why don't you email the whole team to express your "disgust" - Maybe you'll make it to the front page. Perhaps the article wasn't in the best of tastes, and maybe it was unprofessional. But I have no problem with fansites evaluating the competition. I see it happening all the time.

I didn't say it was a good thing to do, so please don't assume. It was very sneaky, you're right. But do you really believe Matt would have given him the time of day in other circumstances? Not at all. He should have made it clear from the beginning, yet didn't. It was still a decent (if not a little fanboyish) debate.

I have no affliation with that website whatsoever.

Ninjazn: Had you 'bet' that I 'go' on Nintendonow. You would have just lost the bet. I occasionally check out their articles, and have registered for their forum board (although I don't think i've ever posted) but apart from that. I very, very rarely visit that website.

Hero

rave on

Posts: 3,765

Join Date: Dec 2004

Bionic Commando
Well, i'm just going on what I have seen from scanning through nunerous threads on here for the past few months. I generally get the impression that a lot of people (not necessarily you) seem to deem IGN as some sort of infallible "reliable" website which has your best interests in mind. Sure thing...

I'm not going to dig up a whole list for you because it would take a long time. Espescially considering the 'Matt bashing' doesn't usually pick up in a thread until at least a few pages in. I remember this one though, so give this one a read if you want:
http://www.n-philes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15883&highlight=Interesting+article

Sorry, I had a mix-up on that front. It wasn't Matt, it was Craig Harris. After IGN recieved many a complaint from THEIR MEMBERS (ie. those who pay subscription fees) which indicated that they had deliberately downplayed the DS launch in Japan, by saying such drivel as: "We'd describe the Japanese DS launch as boring. Then again, we presume we'll look back upon it fondly next week when we're fighting off crowds to get one of the few available PSP units". They acted like little sissies in response, to the very people who pay their wages by stating: "Man, I thought the defensive GameCube fanbase had a bunch of nutcases. But apparently this blind Nintendo faith has trickled into the Nintendo DS population. You guys are absolutely vicious. Where were you during the Game Boy Advance launch?" - Now that's a very smart thing to say. Maybe if they hadn't cocked up in the first place (sending one man to investigate a major launch is a bad idea) they wouldn't have been criticised. Arrogance is all it is. That's the part I found the funniest. Didn't you read the article you slandered?

I read it numerous times. Overall, it made some good points. I can't say I agree with everything he said, but again, he made some good points. One of his biggest complaints though about IGN DS in that article was the constant PSP references. He didn't like that IGN was telling IGN DS readers that the PSP was great, etc, etc. He said (and I'm quoting now):

"Why would they even address the DS fan base in an article about the PSP"

Gee Observer. That's great and all, but the thing is, he did the exact same ****ing thing with his psp article several weeks ago. The only difference between the two was that he was bashing the psp, and IGN was praising it. Quite frankly, either one is crap. Whether is PSP praising or bashing, it doesn't belong on a Nintendo-only site. Period. End of story.

Bionic Commando

You know, some sites don't get paid for their work. Some websites do it for the passion (and the attention). I'm sure he has to keep up a full time job which leaves him restricted from writing articles for a Nintendo fansite. Either way, those two articles are a hell of a lot better than anything i've read from IGN, Gamespy or even Gamespot.

See below.

Bionic Commando

You believe fansites for a particular company aren't allowed to make digs at other companies? You haven't visited many then. The fact is, he backed up everything he said in that article and based his information judging on analysts predictions, past records and technical specifications. Turned out he was right on most fronts.

Then you and I have different definitions of what is acceptable for a fansite. That's cool, but this is just the way I see it. I don't think those types of articles are necessary.

Bionic Commando

Again, if you had a problem with what he had written. You should have posted it on the 'comments' section. It'd have given me a good laugh. The fact is, you're criticising him on a seperate Nintendo fansite he probably isn't even a part of. Grow some balls, and go email him or something. Hell, why don't you email the whole team to express your "disgust" - Maybe you'll make it to the front page.

Haha. Nice one. Really though, Observer already knows how I feel. I actually did leave a few comments for him. I take it he wasn't impressed, because they were deleted within a day or two. Scroll down about halfway and you'll see a lone comment by a 'meloche19'. That was posted by me. It doesn't really make some good points now does it? Probably because at that point I was pretty tired of typing up arguments only to find them gone the next time I logged onto their site. I really don't care if you believe me or not.

About a month later (I think) I decided to give it another go. I got a new account under '3719'. I tried to discuss civily with him and his 'friend' Bowser. It didn't work. Not only were my posts deleted (I think 2 or 3 remain on there), but Observer really showed what he was like. In one of his posts near the bottom of the comments section, you'll see he's quoted me (3719) a few times. Too bad I either didn't say what he quoted, or else he took what I had said way out of context. Let me tell you something. That really, really pissed me off. I left a last comment for him (that was deleted promptly) explaining how he could pretty much shove it, and how terrible a journalist he is. I also sent a nice little note to the staff at Nintendo Now to let them know how one of their writers was behaving in his comments section.

Does he still work there? I sure as hell hope not. Because while he may be a great writer, he's got a lot to learn about acting like a professional. Hell even Craig and Matt could teach him a few things.

Bionic Commando

Perhaps the article wasn't in the best of tastes, and maybe it was unprofessional. But I have no problem with fansites evaluating the competition. I see it happening all the time.

But that's just it. He wasn't evaluating the competition. He was absolutely trashing it. And it couldn't even be called an evaluation, because like I mentioned before, the damn thing hadn't even been released yet. I'm sorry, but no journalist worth anything reviews something that they haven't spent considerable time playing / using.

Bionic Commando

I didn't say it was a good thing to do, so please don't assume. It was very sneaky, you're right. But do you really believe Matt would have given him the time of day in other circumstances? Not at all. He should have made it clear from the beginning, yet didn't. It was still a decent (if not a little fanboyish) debate.

If you know that someone doesn't want you to do something you don't go ahead and do it anyways. That's a really stupid justification for it. That conversation, if Matt didn't want it to take place, shouldn't have happened at all.

Bionic Commando

I have no affliation with that website whatsoever.

Awesome.

Bionic Commando

Tom Cruisin'

Posts: 4,346

Join Date: Apr 2005

Location: Irlanda Del Norte

Haha. I give up, you win. We obviously have a difference in opinions, and that's not going to change anytime soon. It takes time and effort to make long-winded posts like that. And I see no point in continuing as it's simply going around in circles. You make some fair points though. I'll admit that much.

Maybe if you'd stated earlier that you'd commented, I would have cut you some slack (and not made myself look like a total idiot).

On the internet, whoever posts last wins. I don't always agree with that mentality.

Hero

rave on

Posts: 3,765

Join Date: Dec 2004

So then by posting now technically I win right? Tongue

No worries, most arguments like these don't go anywhere anyways. I mean we are talking about videogames after all aren't we? I don't claim to be right, this is just how I feel. NintendoNow seems to have a fairly large fanbase, and if that's what they want to read, all the power to them. I'll just end up sticking with N-Philes - my kind of Nintendo site.

Oh, and I didn't really want to bring up that whole comments dealy because while I still stand by my points, I probably would've been better off just ignoring the article. I doubt I did anything besides piss him off, which, although satisfying, wasn't really worth my time. Or his.

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